Soil Toil and Basement-to-Attic Justice Discussion Series
- Dr. Johnnie C. Larrie (Esq.)
- Oct 21, 2025
- 8 min read
Updated: Mar 18
Exploring Environmental and Spatial Justice with Legacy Bridge NC
Welcome to Legacy Bridge NC’s newest storytelling blog spaces – Soil Toil and Basement-to-Attic Justice.
These two blog series invite you to explore how land, faith, and community come together to shape a more just and regenerative East Winston. Each month, we will share reflections, essays, and voices from the ground that center environmental and spatial justice – especially as they connect to the Brownfields land development on 32+ acres in East Winston.
Soil Toil: Grounded Conversations
The Soil Toil series digs deeply into community-rooted and movement-centered reflections. These pieces capture the pulse of East Winston through storytelling, dialogue, and lived experiences – what we are calling a 'voices from the ground' approach. Here, you will hear from residents, organizers, and community partners who are shaping the land, nurturing the soil, and reclaiming power in East Winston.
Mr. Mohommed said, "The Children...."
Yesterday, a voice rose from Da Island soil and spoke to me -- I had the honor of sitting with Mr. Mohommed Herb, owner of Herb's Bargains, to hear him speak soiled tales! For over an hour, Mr. Mohommed blessed my ears with his insights on, "What it means for him to seed from the soil in terms of helping Black owned and Black focused businesses in East Winston rise from the dust of economic disinvestment."
When you are the owner of a space once held by a slave owner's son, that is some heavy seeding. With over 44 years living in his East Winston community, Mr. Mohommed had a lot to say about his views on his journey with his business in a Winston-Salem geography that has experienced intentional economic disinvestment. But still like dust....
My interview with Mr. Mohommed is being done in several phases, with the first phase taking place yesterday. But before I could really get started, Mr. Mohommed threw a question at me: "How can we influence our Black children towards business?" So we are going to wrap this discussion piece around that question because it sounds like Mr. Mohommed is saying, seeding from the soil cannot be done without the children of East Winston....
But we will pause here and I will pick up on this discussion piece after I take my second trip to Herb's Bargains to listen to Mr. Mohommed speak some more soiled tales....
Mr. Mohommed said, "Get the children and you have the seeds to....build and preserve communities...."
Well, Mr. Mohommed and I resumed our discussion on "what it means to seed from the soil." Of course, he started with the children.
He began by musing about his long history of connecting to children in his community. I had to listen carefully, because it was a quiet more reflective type of musing - the type of musing born of a wisdom cultivated in a community hollowed out of adversity. I paused for a moment to reflect with Mr. Mohommed about this community in East Winston called "Da Island."
Children living in Da Island soil....
Everything is about listening because everything that happens is not necessarily visual. I hear rumblings on Da Island. They are a different type of community rumblings that have the feel of tribal drumbeats. If you put your ear to Da Island soil, you sense those rumblings "be vocal stirrings" about a community Mr. Mohommed says Winston-Salem tried to leave behind. Let’s get to those stirrings. When I ask Mr. Mohommed about being left behind, he just smiles and says, “we still here.” Then he pulls out a small pad and tiny pencil and begins to etch on paper.
He looks up at me, smiling, and says, "I got a degree, but they said, we are not gonna let you teach our children." Mr. Mohommed never did become a teacher in the traditional sense, but that is because he is a very untraditional man. He is both student and scholar of Da Island streets. He always peddled his wisdom from the streets and professed his lessons from sheets of paper on which he had scribbled his life's notes. From those streets, he became a professor of community happenings and taught Black youth who came through his doors, and even those who came within his line of vision.
As is becoming my tradition in conversations with Mr. Mohommed, I took a seat at Herb's Bargains to study Da Island soil a bit more. In the words of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., I am giving myself over to those things that will solve our problems. I am sitting with Mr. Mohommed, as he muses over our Black youth – after all, they are the seeds from which anything and everything can be done to build and preserve communities like Da Island. And, Mr. Mohommed did tell me, "Get the children.... and you have the seeds to....build and preserve communities...."
Here's a little piece of that interview segment:
Me: What does it mean to you to "seed from the soil" with respect to helping Black-owned and Black-focused businesses rise from the dust of economic disinvestment....? I got the sense after talking to you that that was sort of where you were....especially because you felt your business and the community (Da Island) had been purposefully cut off from the rest of Winston-Salem.
Mr. Mohommed: How can we influence our Black children towards business. How can today… we do that….? When I was a little boy, we was headed towards businesses….we had Black businesses everywhere. How can I do something now ….to influence Black children …. to even look at businesses, read about businesses or even go into business. That’s what I would like…..
But then we pivot to talking about Mr. Mohommed’s business – Herb’s Bargain. Herb’s Bargains is housed on the first floor, while Mr. Mohommed resides on the second floor of this space. The space itself is now under threat – from extraordinary wear and tear. Mr. Mohommed notes, some of the “extraordinariness” is due to purposeful economic disinvestment on Da Island. I ask him to tell me what we have to do to “rebuild and repair” here, and whether Black youth can become a part of that process.
Me: If I were your daughter, I would say, we have to fix up this place. What would be the first step to get the young people here…..? What would be their obligation to come here and contribute to the business space? So many young people are not feeling an obligation to their elders or to community. Maybe that is our fault. Tell me what it was like for you when you were coming up. When you were a kid, what was it like [in East Winston]?
Mr. Mohommed: When I was coming up as a kid, we had a whole lot of motivation to go into business.
Me: Why?
Mr. Mohommed: We wanted to be more free...We wanted to have our own. We were so used to going to the white man, we wanted something for ourselves....Older people had that slave mentality, but as we younger ones got wiser, we started thinking for ourselves more....That's what influenced me. I did not want to be like my Granddaddy - working for the white man all the time. I wanted something for my own. I wanted to be like the white man – I wanted to have my own.
Me: So, what’s going on with the Black youth?
Mr. Mohommed: We don't have teachers anymore ... The parents ain't teaching, the schools ain't teaching, the community ain't teaching....How they gonna learn if ain't nobody teaching?
It used to be like….I can take you right here in town and show you the man that showed me, Old Charlie .. like right over there on 14th Street. He grandfathered his store in….He told me the same thing….told the guy on Cleveland…all these little businesses that’s living right now ….he told us to get the buildings grandfathered in so they would make history….Back then, I didn’t understand what he was talking about, but I did it… I grandfathered this in, they got theirs grandfathered in, but their children didn’t take over and redo….like we trying to do here…
They just left the old buildings condemned, like Old Charlie’s place and all them….They grandfathered in that’s why they still standing ….like the one right down there by the projects , that old building right there on the corner and the one over there….and the one on the corner….they grandfathered all in because Old Charlie encouraged us to grandfather all of our businesses in so we would have something left. And that’s what we did….Our children didn’t pick up, but the same old buildings is here….If you did a survey on it, you will see what I am talking about…Old Charlie taught us that….
Me: So this is our fault?
Mr. Mohommed: Yes, it’s our fault….If we do not teach our children, how in the hell is we gonna do it? You tell me. How’s an old guy gonna do it like me?.....I had to read….That’s were it’s at….What would you tell a little Black kid now, about business? What could you tell him? Others have been taught…you want to start a business, go to the Black neighborhood….
Mr. Mohommed told me Black businesses disappeared, because Black youth were taught not to have anything. The next generation became discouraged. Black youth were taught, it’s too hard to have your own business “because of all these rules and regulations” put in place by white-controlled systems. Mr. Mohommed asked me what I thought would happen “if you keep discouraging your children across two generations” to not see themselves as entrepreneurs? But before I could answer, he answered for me: “Same thing happened right here.”
Mr. Mohommed: The way you think, the way you talk, and the way you plan ….
Me: So we are back to the way we seed, right?
Mr. Mohommed just smiles, then we begin talking about the way he seeded from Herb’s Bargains.
Mr. Mohommed: Herb’s Bargains is a Legacy. It was a teaching store for 40 years.
Me: Really?!
Mr. Mohommed: It's right on the front of the store. It's a teaching store. Been there for 40 years. At one time, I had out there, “If you can tell me ten things Black people do well together, I'll give you a $1,000.00.” It stayed out there years -- nobody could do it....
We are going to break for now, but in the next segment, we will spend some time exploring this Legacy, that is still an integral and necessary part of Da Island.
Basement-to-Attic Justice: Elevated Reflections
Our Basement-to-Attic Justice essays rise from lived experience (the Basement) toward spiritual and theological connections and insights (the Attic). These writings explore how faith, organizing, and imagination come together to build just and sustainable communities. We will reflect on the sacred work of land stewardship, participatory planning, and the moral call to environmental justice – all through the lens of East Winston’s transformation.
Developing Discussion Themes:
• Communities-as-Congregations – (Click here for the prologue introducing this themed discussion)
• Environmental and Spatial Justice in East Winston
• Theologically Based Practices in Ecological Sufficiency
• [Re]Modeling Land Ownership and Stewardship – resisting extractive capitalism
• Community Organizing and Participatory Planning – the Voices of Solidarity model
• Food, Housing, and Health Justice – who nourishes East Winston?
• Voices from the Ground – interviews and reflections from community members
• The Theology of Land Liberation – 32 Acres and a Mule
• Wholeness, Authenticity, and Justice – as sacred acts of neighborly kindness
• The Economics of Soul & Soil – Preaching While Eating
• Jesus, Justice, and the Politics of Resource Distribution
• Regenerative Futures and Spiritual Solidarity Ecology
Join the Conversation
As these writings unfold, we invite you to read, reflect, and respond. Whether you are a community member, faith leader, activist, or ally, your perspective matters in the ongoing story of East Winston’s renewal.
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